New game- no human kingdoms?

[gkmetty]

HI Everyone,

These are two very interesting ideas, restricted kingdoms and Ice Age. I dont know that they go well together.

If I remember properly, Ice Age means persistent reduced production. Can you imagine having the last pick and being stuck with the RD? To give an example I am playing a game as the RD and we just completed turn 5. I own my northern region, so a bad season, and I have a town in the south. My total food production is 14k. I have 11 brigades and my consumption is 34k. Food consumption on turn zero was 22k. Most of the kingdoms listed as available in this game have decent military components, BL, DW, EL, LI, RD TY, these kingdoms will either need to forgo military or be crippled by lack of production.

I would be interested in participating in either the restricted Kingdoms or Ice Age but if combined I will be happy to observe.

[Pine Needle]

HI Everyone,

These are two very interesting ideas, restricted kingdoms and Ice Age.  I dont know that they go well together.

If I remember properly, Ice Age means persistent reduced production.  Can you imagine having the last pick and being stuck with the RD?  To give an example I am playing a game as the RD and we just completed turn 5.  I own my northern region, so a bad season, and I have a town in the south.  My total food production is 14k.  I have 11 brigades and my consumption is 34k.  Food consumption on turn zero was 22k.  Most of the kingdoms listed as available in this game have decent military components, BL, DW, EL, LI, RD TY, these kingdoms will either need to forgo military or be crippled by lack of production.

I would be interested in participating in either the restricted Kingdoms or Ice Age but if combined I will be happy to observe.

That's cool. I think we are in for this idea, but you're right- food will be tight immediately. Maybe turn 2 or 3. I predict fireworks.

[VballMichael]

So, if we combine these 2 ideas, a lot of the outcome will be decided by someone outside the game who rolls our selection order. I am ok with that; I tend to be lucky on rolls. Now watch, I will get position 12.

[Pine Needle]

So, if we combine these 2 ideas, a lot of the outcome will be decided by someone outside the game who rolls our selection order. I am ok with that; I tend to be lucky on rolls. Now watch, I will get position 12.

I don't know if that would be bad.

[unclemike]

HI Everyone,

These are two very interesting ideas, restricted kingdoms and Ice Age.  I dont know that they go well together.

If I remember properly, Ice Age means persistent reduced production.  Can you imagine having the last pick and being stuck with the RD?  To give an example I am playing a game as the RD and we just completed turn 5.  I own my northern region, so a bad season, and I have a town in the south.  My total food production is 14k.  I have 11 brigades and my consumption is 34k.  Food consumption on turn zero was 22k.  Most of the kingdoms listed as available in this game have decent military components, BL, DW, EL, LI, RD TY, these kingdoms will either need to forgo military or be crippled by lack of production.

I would be interested in participating in either the restricted Kingdoms or Ice Age but if combined I will be happy to observe.

Yes, in Ice Age, you have to be aggressive for those food-hungry troops so it's a challenge and not for the light-hearted. But it's a fun format and something different to do if there's interest.

Regarding the RD, your brigades have such a high defensive value that you can split them up into 5 smaller sized groups and go after villages in nearby regions. In just 3 turns, you can grab up to 15 villages with those 5 groups. That's pretty fast and a significant increase in food during an Ice Age. Not all kingdoms can move that fast or gain that much. Also, don't forget that an Ice Age is when the dragon kingdoms may land on frozen water areas for pc's and encounters. That's not allowed in a normal game so enjoy stretching your wings in this game.

Other kingdoms can boost up food production by: wizard create food/fertile field/bounty spells, increase pc food production with order 600, recruit cheap-ass troops that don't need much food (you may like recruiting different troops than what you're used to), or just go forth and conquer like mad! It should be a faster paced game than normal because everyone is a bit desperate.

[gkmetty]

HI Everyone,

These are two very interesting ideas, restricted kingdoms and Ice Age.  I dont know that they go well together.

If I remember properly, Ice Age means persistent reduced production.  Can you imagine having the last pick and being stuck with the RD?  To give an example I am playing a game as the RD and we just completed turn 5.  I own my northern region, so a bad season, and I have a town in the south.  My total food production is 14k.  I have 11 brigades and my consumption is 34k.  Food consumption on turn zero was 22k.  Most of the kingdoms listed as available in this game have decent military components, BL, DW, EL, LI, RD TY, these kingdoms will either need to forgo military or be crippled by lack of production.

I would be interested in participating in either the restricted Kingdoms or Ice Age but if combined I will be happy to observe.

Yes, in Ice Age, you have to be aggressive for those food-hungry troops so it's a challenge and not for the light-hearted. But it's a fun format and something different to do if there's interest.

Regarding the RD, your brigades have such a high defensive value that you can split them up into 5 smaller sized groups and go after villages in nearby regions. In just 3 turns, you can grab up to 15 villages with those 5 groups. That's pretty fast and a significant increase in food during an Ice Age. Not all kingdoms can move that fast or gain that much. Also, don't forget that an Ice Age is when the dragon kingdoms may land on frozen water areas for pc's and encounters. That's not allowed in a normal game so enjoy stretching your wings in this game.

Other kingdoms can boost up food production by: wizard create food/fertile field/bounty spells, increase pc food production with order 600, recruit cheap-ass troops that don't need much food (you may like recruiting different troops than what you're used to), or just go forth and conquer like mad! It should be a faster paced game than normal because everyone is a bit desperate.

I'm interested in watching but you over estimate your capability to find and take villages.  With your plan you would have 1 RD brigade in each of 5 groups and 1 group would have your extra Wyvern.  After taking your first village with 1 brigade of RD it would be questionable if you could take a second and you would almost certainly bounce trying to take the third, unless your RD brigades are different then the ones I have.  Your food will run out around turn 4.  You will actually lose more in food spoilage then you would produce the first 4 turns, the math is easy, you can check.   After turn 4 you will start to lose morale and as you know the loss compounds and turns to attrition.  My guess is the dragon kingdoms dont make it to turn 10 and the TY kingdom only goes farther if it gets lucky.  You also forget that you need gold.  If you execute your plan you will be producing just enough to support your troops which means you cant use your emmies.  The good news is your plan to take villages will result in the loss of troops.  Once your troops are gone you can use your extensive emmie corps.

Keep me in mind if the game does not fill and you are willing to do one or the other, restricted kingdoms or Ice age.

[unclemike]

Hang on here, it's really not that bad for the RD. Even if you use only 3 groups rather than the full 5, you'll still can grab 6-9 villages in 2-3 turns. That's still pretty good with little or no damage to your troops. Also, all kingdoms in Ice Age start off with an extra 25,000 food to spend on turn 0 (read the Ice Age notes) and the two dragon kingdoms also have those special groves starting on turn 4 for an extra 20,000 gold not affected by the ever present winter.

As for other kingdoms, I think smaller sized regions provide about 10,000 food per turn during an Ice Age (if you remove the city penalty) and larger regions produce about 17,000 food. So if you use 3 groups instead of 5 to conquer villages, those 6 extra villages will add about 9,000 more food per turn for a production around 19,000 food for small regions and 26,000 food for larger regions. That's just 2 turns of conquering villages so it's not really that bad but you do have to be aggressive during an Ice Age if you're a military oriented kingdom.

Thinking about all of this reminds me of the Game of Thrones scene of the dragons breathing fire upon the undead troops of the north...

[Strongwill]

I was remembering the Dragons kicking butt in ice age games? Maybe I’m wrong? Checking Valhalla under kingdoms BL lasted 21 turns RD 29 turns in only 1 ea placed ice age game.

[Windstar]

Maybe we should have two different queues here. One for the Ice Age, and one for the Non-Human kingdoms. Each is challenged, and together they might be too much.

[VballMichael]

Given all this, I suggest we just do Ice Age and make all kingdoms available. The non-human thing is cool as a concept, but has no real game effect except to limit kingdoms (and we even added 2 human kingdoms back in to make it to 12). Also, even when we have limited kingdoms in the past like with the Tallest Midget contest, we still had at least 14 kingdoms so nobody was forced to a single, particular kingdom. 

I like both concepts, but would not want to play Ice Age and also perhaps be driven by a bad roll to play a kingdom I am not interested in or have already played a bunch.