Game 5736 - Full Communication - 12 Player Game - 48 Hour Turn Interval

[Wookie Panz]

OOC: Out Of Character

Turn #6

Every game of Alamaze has its own twists and turns. Things happen, and players have their own individual reasons for why they do the things that they do. Tonight, in between a variety of different tasks that I hope to finish (someday, even if not tonight), I find myself browsing my kingdom's turn results for Turn #6 in Game #5736.

The village of Neptune, located at area NS, has now returned to the Demon Princes' fold. Of course, how long I retain control of it, this time, remains to be seen.

If Pine Needle, player of the Fairy Folk in this game of Alamaze, is inclined to share with me, why would you risk a war against your kingdom's Southern neighbor, at the same time that you are faced off against DuPont and his Cimmerians in the North?

I grasp that numerous different experienced veterans of many Alamaze wars in the past like to gain total control of their home regions. I get that. I understand it. But not every Alamaze player, myself being one of them, subscribes to the philosophy of, if another kingdom starts the game with a population center in one's "home region" (the region where most of a given kingdom's assets are located, when the game begins), then the "expectation" is that it is simply OK to just go ahead and root that other fellow out.

It really didn't even cross my mind, when I sent my kingdom's turn orders in for this turn (Turn #6), that it was going to be a turn where our kingdoms received their current "score" for the game.

Out of ten kingdoms still being actively played in this particular game of Alamaze, it comes as no surprise to me that my kingdom is way down near the bottom of the pile. I really don't care about the numbers, and I definitely don't care for numerical scores in wargames. But the Fairy Folk score of 308 being lower than my Demon Princes' score of 550, it really pokes at my brain noodle. Is it typical for the Fairy Folk kingdom to have such a low score on Turn #6 of most games of Alamaze that they are being played in? Hell, I don't even know what is an "average" score for any kingdom that I am playing in any of my games of Alamaze.

DuPont, by comparison, he always has his eye on the scoring system. Hey, he wants to win, right? So, he always starts blasting out a very high score, in any game that he's in, I have no doubt. I really do need to read up on the Fairy Folk kingdom. I don't know that much about it, but I do like the concept of having a fairy kingdom available for Alamaze players to choose from.

I'm sure that over the span of the next six turns, there will be many other different twists and turns that will take place. Hell, my kingdom could potentially be eliminated in the next six turns.

In games of Hyborian War that I have played over the years, I tend to pay as much attention to the players that I am playing with in a game of Hyborian War as I do to the kingdoms that they are playing. I'm not trying to pry away any "state secrets," but there's probably no quicker way to ignite a war with a kingdom that I am playing in a game of Alamaze, than to just come barreling out the gate, and boot me out of a lone population center that lies far away from any real way for me to assist its plight. I don't subscribe to what I view to be a sense of royal entitlement (or whatever it should be called) on the part of others to population centers that the game places under my control at game start.

Some of you guys have played a wide variety of different kingdoms, before, or maybe even all kingdoms, as well as having perhaps played the same kingdom, time and time and time, again. For me, this is the third time that I have signed up to play the kingdom of the Demon Princes. While I don't tend to go hog wild on role playing kingdoms that I preside over, I do have a very hard time coming to grips with actual Demon Princes considering early snatching of their kingdom's population centers to not be a big deal.

Dispatching a Demon Prince character to "recover" this village of Neptune wasn't a particularly complicated undertaking. But prior to that village being seized through the wielding of direct political influence, I really hadn't even decided upon what kingdom or kingdoms out there that the Demon princes would be going to war with. Now, I'm not mad at Pine Needle for "volunteering" to go to war with the Demon Princes kingdom, but I would like to better understand where individual players come from in their thinking, on making decisions of this nature.

In browsing my turn results for Turn #6, even though I've searched for population centers in all of my starting region of The Untamed Lands, and even though I seem to now control every population center in this region that I can see, I noticed that while I have gained control of this region, I do not have tight control of it. This, of course, indicates to me that there's one or more additional population centers in this region that are hidden - and which will have to be revealed through other means.

Which indicates to me that, perhaps there is a Lizard-controlled population center in my home region after all. Do kingdoms routinely begin the game with hidden population centers located in regions other than their starting home region(s)? I was thinking, correctly or incorrectly, that when your kingdom started the game with a hidden population center, that it would be in your home region.

Max, only kingdoms that have the secretive trait have hidden pc's and it will be their capital, with one exception.  Hobbits can have several hidden villages.  My experience has been that in Maelstrom you never start with another players hidden capital in your starting region.

[Maximus Dominus]

Max, only kingdoms that have the secretive trait have hidden pc's and it will be their capital, with one exception.  Hobbits can have several hidden villages.  My experience has been that in Maelstrom you never start with another players hidden capital in your starting region.

Hobbits? Halflings, you mean?

OK, so I went back in, just now, and looked at Turn #0 for this game, and the Halflings don't seem to be in this one. I also went back in and checked every population center in The Untamed Lands, to double-check the current ownership of each one, and they all are controlled by my kingdom.

The Alamaze rulebook says:

Tight Control – Represents 100% control of all the population centers in the region.
Allows raising regional reactions to Loyal. Kingdom cannot be denigrated in regions
with Tight Control.

SOURCE: 4th Cycle: Maelstrom Rulebook - Page #51


Turn #6's results say:

    Demon Princes Regional Summary:
                                    Regional        Reaction        Controlling
            Region                  Influence      Level          Kingdom

        The Crown Islands (1)      Unestablished  Hostile        NA
        Darkover (2)                Unestablished  Hostile        Lycans(T)
        The Diamond Coast (3)      Unestablished  Hostile        Cimmerians(T)
        Krynn (4)                  Unestablished  Hostile        NA
        Triumvia (5)                Unestablished  Hostile        NA
        Zanthia (6)                Unestablished  Hostile        Dwarven(T)
        Nyvaria (7)                Minor          Hostile        NA
        The Sword Coast (8)        Unestablished  Hostile        Giants(T)
        Pellinor (9)                Unestablished  Hostile        Elven
        Zamora (10)                Unestablished  Hostile        Necromancer
        Mythgar (11)                Minor          Tolerant        Lizard Men
        The Untamed Lands (12)      Control        Friendly        Demon Princes
        Stormgate (13)              Unestablished  Hostile        NA


So, no Total Control. I'm just trying to understand what I'm missing.

[Wookie Panz]

Max, only kingdoms that have the secretive trait have hidden pc's and it will be their capital, with one exception.  Hobbits can have several hidden villages.  My experience has been that in Maelstrom you never start with another players hidden capital in your starting region.

Hobbits? Halflings, you mean?

OK, so I went back in, just now, and looked at Turn #0 for this game, and the Halflings don't seem to be in this one. I also went back in and checked every population center in The Untamed Lands, to double-check the current ownership of each one, and they all are controlled by my kingdom.

The Alamaze rulebook says:

Tight Control – Represents 100% control of all the population centers in the region.
Allows raising regional reactions to Loyal. Kingdom cannot be denigrated in regions
with Tight Control.

SOURCE: 4th Cycle: Maelstrom Rulebook - Page #51


Turn #6's results say:

    Demon Princes Regional Summary:
                                    Regional        Reaction        Controlling
            Region                  Influence      Level          Kingdom

        The Crown Islands (1)      Unestablished  Hostile        NA
        Darkover (2)                Unestablished  Hostile        Lycans(T)
        The Diamond Coast (3)      Unestablished  Hostile        Cimmerians(T)
        Krynn (4)                  Unestablished  Hostile        NA
        Triumvia (5)                Unestablished  Hostile        NA
        Zanthia (6)                Unestablished  Hostile        Dwarven(T)
        Nyvaria (7)                Minor          Hostile        NA
        The Sword Coast (8)        Unestablished  Hostile        Giants(T)
        Pellinor (9)                Unestablished  Hostile        Elven
        Zamora (10)                Unestablished  Hostile        Necromancer
        Mythgar (11)                Minor          Tolerant        Lizard Men
        The Untamed Lands (12)      Control        Friendly        Demon Princes
        Stormgate (13)              Unestablished  Hostile        NA


So, no Total Control. I'm just trying to understand what I'm missing.

Are there squares that you have not searched for p.c.?

[Maximus Dominus]

Are there squares that you have not searched for p.c.?

Nope. All areas in the Untamed Lands have been searched for population centers.

There's no "fog of war" cloud on any of the areas in this region, for me. I'm just trying to figure out what I'm overlooking/missing.

[Wookie Panz]

Beats me.  Any other readers have an insight to this?

[Maximus Dominus]

OOC: Out Of Character
Turn #7

Turn #7 gets processed, and two more Fairy Folk villages fall before the Demon Princes - which is pretty much what I expected, at this stage of the game and how it's begun unfolding.

But an interesting wrinkle has now appeared. The Cimmerians under the infamous DuPont's command, has chosen to move one of its military groups [ 1CI {Army} ] to area PU, which is one of the villages that my Demon Princes usurped from the Fairy Folk, this turn.

   

According to the Alamaze forum member list, DuPont was last signed in for a visit here back on October 3rd, 2023 at 10:42PM. Granted, he could simply visit the Alamaze forum and read forum postings while not being logged in, but perhaps DuPont has grown a bit distracted, of late, by real life and other considerations.

My guess is that he was well aware that a Fairy Folk village was in this location, but when he looks at his turn results for Turn #7, he will learn that the Demon Princes now control that population center. This, in turn, will activate the cogs in his brain, and he will have to decide whether to risk widening his current war, by attacking this village. What an interesting dilemma this presents - for him, for the Fairy Folk, and for me.

I don't assume that he will attack, but I also don't assume that he won't attack. It is a possibility, but not the only possibility. My gut whispers to me that DuPont's Cimmerians will likely attack. Why wouldn't he? He's not a player that, by his experienced nature, is naturally inclined to be scared of the outcome. Indeed, he will likely calculate the outcome in short order, if he hasn't done so, already. Plus, too, he's playing the Cimmerians, in this game of Alamaze, and I have a suspicion that he will see that kingdom as militarily-oriented.

This is arguably one of the best scenarios that could possibly happen, from the Fair Folk player's perspective, I imagine. If war is ignited, whether intentionally or unintentionally between the Fair Folk and the Demon Princes over the Fairy Folk stealing a village from the Demon Princes in the Fairy Folk's home region, what is the likely outcome, if the Cimmerians militarily assault and conquer by brute force a Demon Princes' village that they only just seized control of from the Fairy Folks via usurpation (the same method that the Fairy Folk used to steal the Demon Princes' village of Neptune, in the first place)?

Speaking from the perspective of being the Demon Princes player in this particular game of Alamaze, I'd say that the most likely outcome of a Cimmerian military attack upon the village of Longleaf Market in the coming turn would be that the Demon Princes kingdom would consider that to be a deliberate and premeditated act of war. After all, no matter what kingdom controlled this village at the end of last turn, DuPont will learn of a change in its ownership, when he reads his Turn #7 results. Thus, no military attack upon this village by the Cimmerians can take place without it being a conscious, deliberate, and willful act on the part of the Cimmerians' player.

As an Alamaze player, I don't really care about the score and winning and losing. What I do care about is what other players choose to do. Personally, I have no qualms, whatsoever, about going to war with multiple different kingdoms, simultaneously. It's not real people dying, after all. It's little more than a game of Risk, from my perspective. At worst, I lose and my kingdom gets conquered, and I find myself out of the game.

By now, even if he had not already done so, before (which he probably had), the Fairy Folk player will begin to communicate with one or more other players in earnest. That's not a Pine Needle thing, per se, but rather, that's just how players in war games that allow communication between players tend to react in similar situations. At the Turn #7 mark of a game of Alamaze, I think it to be exceedingly doubtful that the Fairy Folk player, no matter whom it might be, has already amassed sufficient power and force as to enable that kingdom to overcome and prevail in a very weary war against two different kingdoms.

The Cimmerians are likely to press the Fairy Folk, and press them hard and to their limits, in a military sense. The Demon Princes, on the other hand, are likely to press the Fairy Folk hard on the political influence front. That is, until the Cimmerians moved a military group into position to possibly launch an assault upon what is, now, a Demon Princes controlled village.

The Fairy Folk player, Pine Needle, has displayed no interest, thus far, in trying to walk things back, diplomatically. But on the other hand, his kingdom has now gained control of his home region of Nyvaria. That has to be a motivator, a bright spot in an otherwise darkening situation. But will it prove to be sufficient, to fend off not one, but two enemy kingdoms now bearing down upon the region of Nyvaria?

So, my expectation, now, is that one or two (or possibly more) kingdom(s) will soon make the decision to try and aid the Fairy Folk, even though their own decisions are what brought at least one of these two wars to their kingdom's doorstep at this early point in the game.

Of course, if the Demon Princes kingdom has any advantage in their starting arsenal of tricks/capabilities, it's the ability to wage war at a distance, via their use of Demon Prince characters and Demonic Gates. All that I need is the location of population centers (which other kingdoms might be willing to provide to me), in order to begin disrupting other kingdoms political situations. How much of a headache can the Demon Princes kingdom be? Obviously, that depends upon an array of different factors. Currently playing the Demon Princes in three different games of Alamaze will, hopefully, provide me some insight into how to play this particular kingdom better than I otherwise might.

Players will do what players will do, of course. And like all players, I have (and I develop) my own approach to playing Alamaze. No experienced Alamaze player in their right mind fears my modicum of experience with playing the game. That said, I always view Alamaze as being an exercise in asymmetrical warfare. Each kingdom begins the game with its own respective strengths and weaknesses. What I lack in experience, I can, if properly motivated, simply seek expertise which experience affords from others who already possess it. Experienced Alamaze players, after all, are typically quite willing to share the wisdom that they've gained over the course of countless wars in countless different epochs of Alamaze that have come before.

And so it is that we now enter Turn #8 in Game #5736 of Alamaze. I wonder what other turns and twists will now manifest themselves over the course of the next several turns. I would take this opportunity to remind other players in this game of the fact that the reason why the Demon Princes are at war with the Fairy Folk is due to the fact that the Fairy Folk decided to steal a population center that the Demon Princes started the game already in control of. There are probably more noble causes to come to the aid of.

[Maximus Dominus]

Out Of Character

Turn #7

(Continued)

Typically, kingdoms' most powerful military group tends to be their 1st Group, and especially early in the game.

So, if the Cimmerians' 1st CI group is currently off on some military campaign in area PU of the region of Nyvaria, then who's holding down the fort back home in their home region of The Diamond Coast?

Doesn't that induce an element of vulnerability into the Cimmerians' grand plan?

Or can they spare their 1st CI group, and still prove capable of mounting a robust defense of their homeland? Clearly, DuPont is a very confident player.

[Pine Needle]

FF-DE

My ancient tomes have shown no communication from the Cimmerian Dog, errr King, over many planes of existence. I will continue to protect the forest denizens of Nyvaria, and perhaps many small stings will drive the dog off. You can expect the same treatment if you walk my forests with ill intent.



Lady Pole

[Maximus Dominus]

FF-DE

My ancient tomes have shown no communication from the Cimmerian Dog, errr King, over many planes of existence. I will continue to protect the forest denizens of Nyvaria, and perhaps many small stings will drive the dog off. You can expect the same treatment if you walk my forests with ill intent.

Lady Pole

Fairy Contrary,

You dare to speak of ill intent, after dispatching your emissary uninvited to our village of Neptune, previously, as you prepared to steal it?

You choose your words poorly, squandering every opportunity to restore peace to your own land, as you now boast how we Demon Princes can expect "the same treatment" as befits a Cimmerian dog. A threat, no doubt. But what are small stings compared to the torments of Hell?

The Demons Three

[Pine Needle]

Many apologies Demon Lords for the village which I will no longer aspire to benevolently rule. I look at it more like eating the gooseberry trifle before the raspberry tart. Certainly something polite people would not do, but not an act of war. My humblest apologies.

I will be battling the Cimmerians and leaving your village alone.

Lady Pole Queen of Trifle