Brigade comparisons

[Olorin]

Cockatrices [3]:
We thought about upping these to 5, but that special ability? Adding 10% to kill enemy leaders and wizards per Brigade. Plus 50% chance to die? Um, no. 3 is bad enough. Now these are flying snake-turkeys, not that great at fighting. Pretty much by the stories they have to peck you, but that is all they have to do to kill you. They have no way to really attack at LR, or even SR. But I can see not many folks willing to stand in the way when they run at you. Where they get dangerous is when you get tired and stop getting that shield in its way.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Very Poor, Poor, Absent
SR:Average, Below Average, Absent
CH:Average, Average, Excellent
M1:Good, Excellent, Average
M2:Good, Superior, Excellent
CO:Above Average, Average, Very Good
DE:Good, Below Average, Below Average
ST:Above Average, Average, Average

---

Cyclops [3]:
These seem to be a little brother to Hill Giants, a unique Companion to Giants. Considering there are fewer of the Cyclops we upped its strength relative to the Hill Giants instead.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Good, Good, Good
SR:Above Average, Average, Good
CH:Excellent, Excellent, Very Good
M1:Good, Excellent, Good
M2:Above Average, Average, Excellent
CO:Good, Very Good. Very Good
DE:Excellent, Superior, Renowned
ST:Good, Excellent, Renowned

---

Dark Elves:
Dangerous bowmen. Not quite as good as Elves, otherwise pretty much the same. Their advantages lie elsewhere.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Renowned, Excellent, Renowned
SR:Good, Good, Renowned
CH:Good, Good, Above Average
M1:Above Average, Good, Average
M2:Average, Below Average, Average
CO:Above Average, Good, Average
DE:Above Average, Average, Average
ST:Above Average, Above Average, Average

---

Demon Princes:
These troops are just kind of lazy. I mean why try to scale a wall when a Prince is just gonna teleport in? They are fairly close to normal troops, just a little short on the training. [You will note we did not change much from the Actual.]

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Average, Average, Average
SR:Average, Average, Average
CH:Above Average, Average, Average
M1:Average, Below Average, Below Average
M2:Average, Below Average, Below Average
CO:Average, Poor, Below Average
DE:Average, Below Average, Below Average
ST:Average, Below Average, Poor

[Olorin]

The one everyone loves to hate, Deathknights:
Honestly, what makes them dangerous is that he modeled them on the Dwarves, exactly down the line. Then gave them tier 2 magic on top of the other advantages. That and the pit fiends. So we changed that up a bit. Starting with breaking off from the Dwarves. This is not to say they are not dangerous. They stay a military power. But since when were any Knights good with a bow? Again, you will notice they are severely understated in posted for what they have actually.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Good, Good, Average
SR:Above Average, Average, Good
CH:Good, Good, Excellent
M1:Good, Superior, Excellent
M2:Good, Excellent, Excellent
CO:Good, Very Good, Excellent
DE:Above Average, Above Average, Average
ST:Above Average, Good, Above Average

---

Damned [10]:
Yes, Damned are poor troops. We have not really changed them. Several of the Actual barely missed Poor, so when others improved it pushed them over.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Below Average, Below Average, Average
SR:Below Average, Poor, Poor
CH:Below Average, Below Average, Below Average
M1:Below Average, Below average, Poor
M2:Average, Below Average, Below Average
CO:Average, Below Average, Poor
DE:Below Average, Below Average, Below Average
ST:Below Average, Below Average, Poor

---

Druid:
One of the things that surprised me was how often the Actual for the 'regular' brigade types was a category or two under the Posted. Yes, we gave Druid's a bad rating vs walls, it just seemed appropriate that they do not deal well with them. SR and CH is all the animals helping.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Average, Average, Average
SR:Above Average, Average, Good
CH:Above Average, Average, Good
M1:Average, Below Average, Average
M2:Above Average, Average, Average
CO:Average, Below Average, Average
DE:Average, Below Average, Below Average
ST:Average, Below Average, Poor

---

Dwarves:
We agreed that Dwarves should be more formidable since they have such a disadvantage in magic. Most everything moved up.

LR:Good, Good, Good
SR:Above Average, Average, Good
CH:Good, Good, Good
M1:Good, Superior, Excellent
M2:Good, Excellent, Superior
CO:Good, Very Good, Excellent
DE:Above Average, Above Average, Excellent
ST:Above Average, Good, Above Average

---

Air Elementals [10]:
This brings us to the Elementals and Monster Summons. For some reason these were all posted with the same stats as the Elves, even when the stats were different. I am assuming they were placeholders and just never got fixed. We adjusted the ratings to match more of what we thought each Elemental would be like. Obviously, Air Elementals would be good with ranged, but not really equipped for hand-to-hand.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Awesome, Awesome, Excellent
SR:Very good, Excellent, Excellent
CH:Above Average, Average, Below Average
M1:Above Average, Average, Poor
M2:Above Average, Average, Not A Factor
CO:Above Average, Good, Very poor
DE:Above Average, Good, Average
ST:Above Average, Above Average, Average

[Olorin]

Earth Elementals [10]:
Honestly, an earth Elemental is going to have a hard time with the concept of throwing something. And it would just rise up instead of charge. On the other hand it would have a good laugh at the idea of a wall blocking it.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Awesome, Awesome, Absent
SR:Very Good, Excellent, Absent
CH:Above Average, Average, Below Average
M1:Above Average, Average, Renowned
M2:Above Average, Average, Awesome
CO:Above Average, Good, Excellent
DE:Above Average, Superior, Renowned
ST:Above Average, Above Average, Ultimate

[davekuyk]

Great info, thanks Olorin.

A note on Cockatrices (and Scorpions). While having three Cockatrices presumably provides a 30% bonus to kill leaders, it either doesn't work as intended or doesn't work at all. I have had numerous encounters, either as the FT or against the FT, and have never had a leader die in a battle where Cockatrices were involved. Some of these battles also include weapon artifacts which would presumably add another 10 to 25% chance to kill a leader. The sample size is still small, I admit. I suspect the math work something like (chance to die) * 1.3 (for three Cokckatrices). If the (chance to die) is 10% then the chance increases to 13%.

What I am saying is, I believe it would be fine to allow kingdoms with access to Cockatrices to recruit five of them.

[Olorin]

Great info, thanks Olorin.

A note on Cockatrices (and Scorpions). While having three Cockatrices presumably provides a 30% bonus to kill leaders, it either doesn't work as intended or doesn't work at all. I have had numerous encounters, either as the FT or against the FT, and have never had a leader die in a battle where Cockatrices were involved. Some of these battles also include weapon artifacts which would presumably add another 10 to 25% chance to kill a leader. The sample size is still small, I admit. I suspect the math work something like (chance to die) * 1.3 (for three Cokckatrices). If the (chance to die) is 10% then the chance increases to 13%.

What I am saying is, I believe it would be fine to allow kingdoms with access to Cockatrices to recruit five of them.

Thanks for the info.  Both of us were thinking it added 10 percentage points to the chance.  If it only multiplies the chance by .1 that really does make a difference. So even with 5 Cockatrice and 5 Scorpions it would only double the percentage of having a kill. Which is pretty strong, just not plus 100% strong.

---

Fire Elementals [5]:
One of our balancing works was balancing the relative power of Summoned creatures. We tried to set it up so higher level spells got higher power creatures, and that you would get fewer as the strength got higher. Is it perfect? Probably not, but still better than patchwork.
Fire Elementals do not really have a LR. That intense heat wave arrives early, though, so the high SR. But then everything is burnt so the charge is through non-flammable, so slow. But fire hurts and elementals really do not tire much. And Storm is a mixed bag, wood walls burn easy but stone not so much.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Awesome, Awesome, Absent
SR:Very good, Excellent, Renowned
CH:Above Average, Average, Below Average
M1:Above Average, Average, Good
M2:Above Average, Average, Excellent
CO:Above Average, Good, Good
DE:Above Average, Good, Good
ST:Above Average, Above Average, Average

---

Elves:
Really, REALLY good archers. The rest pretty normal. Will they need more? There was a strong power up on the ranged stuff in general and we will have to see what settles out.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Awesome, Awesome, Awesome
SR:Very good, Excellent, Awesome
CH:Above Average, Average, Average
M1:Above Average, Average, Average
M2:Above Average, Average, Average
CO:Above Average, Good, Above Average
DE:Above Average, Good, Average
ST:Above Average, Above Average, Average

[Olorin]

Elementalist:
This is an example of Posted vs Actual. Almost every rating is a step lower. Most of what we did here was simply say what their rating really was. Storm got pushed down by others being better rather than really changing much. We did improve their LR a bit, help from lesser air elementals I guess.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Average, Below Average, Good
SR:Average, Below Average, Below Average
CH:Average, Average, Average
M1:Above Average, Average, Average
M2:Average, Below Average, Below Average
CO:Average, Below Average, Below Average
DE:Average, Below Average, Below Average
ST:Average, Below Average, Poor

---

Ents [5]:
We are looking at making these the equivalent of the trolls for good kingdoms. Since we cannot change the codes for trolls we gave a big upgrade to the ents for Storm. Just read Tolkien for that. Again, these are not known for LR, and would not be much for SR, or even charge. Kind of a slow march, really. But up close fighting? Yeouch. How many limbs per tree?

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Below Average, Below Average, Absent
SR:Average, Average, Poor
CH:Average, Average, Average
M1:Good, Good, Superior
M2:Good, Average, Renowned
CO:Good, Very Good, Excellent
DE:Very Good, Excellent, Excellent
ST:Very Good, Excellent, Ultimate

---

Ettins [5]:
Ettins are an example of the Summons spells balance I was talking about earlier. they are a pow-6 Summons. At a level with Water Elementals, Rock Golems, Ghouls and Pit Fiends, so they should be about equivalent in power. Barring special abilities. I am sure it is a surprise to you all that this was less an exercise in building up Ettins and more debuffing Pit Fiends.

We figured they throw rocks well, have the typical stomping charge of a giant, but tire easily. As per usual for giants, they play havoc with walls.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Awesome, Awesome, Good
SR:Very good, Excellent, Good
CH:Above Average, Average, Good
M1:Above Average, Average, Above Average
M2:Above Average, Average, Average
CO:Above Average, Good, Average
DE:Above Average, Good, Renowned
ST:Above Average, Above Average, Excellent

---

Water Elementals [5]:
Speaking of which, as above, these are the most powerful Elemental. They still do not throw things, though. What they do do is make a wall of water. Ever see a flash flood in a narrow gully? That is their charge, which then makes the battlefield a plain of mud and bad footing. Which they do not care about, improving their fighting prowess compared to yours while letting them hide. Argh. Storm is still a mixed bag as walls can be reinforced, solid, or porous.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Awesome, Awesome, Absent
SR:Very good, Excellent, Absent
CH:Above Average, Average, Awesome
M1:Above Average, Average, Excellent
M2:Above Average, Average, Excellent
CO:Above Average, Good, Excellent
DE:Above Average, Good, Excellent
ST:Above Average, Above Average, Average

[Olorin]

Before I get to Fairy Folk I wanted to address this.

If I may make a suggestion to help the weighting evaluations.
Reinforcement schedule and terrain adjustments would also inform the rating system. As those of a certain age will remember with the Urik and more recently with the Fairies, heavy reinforcement schedules can offset (or at least compensate for) subpar brigade values.

When the game first started, they set an average for defense, so a slightly low defense was not all that bad. The problem is they never updated that average. That 'slightly' low turned into an abysmal rating for Fairy Folk and Underworld as the actual average climbed. Worse for FF, their largest number of Companions rated about the same. Pixies rated almost at the bottom, Sprites just barely better than FF. More Reinforcements rated at the bottom of the defense scale just exacerbates the problem.

When I said we discovered that defense was very important, it has a lot of implications for the groups. It is not just the individual brigades that are affected. Your group has a defense rating based on adding each Brigades defense to all the others and then averaging them. This gets important when you add Brigades. A Superior Brigade with two of Average will raise the Average ones a bit more than the Superior will lose. 10 Poor will drag the single Superior down to Below Average. If you have an Average defense Kingdom Brigade, having Below Average or lower Companions mixed in will drop the defense rating for the group. Adding higher rated brigades will raise it. This gets even more important to keep in mind as the groups get bigger.

As your defense drops for the group as a whole, they get damaged more easily and retreat faster than you were likely expecting. Remember, the damage your opponent inflicts is divided by your group's defense rating.

---

Fairy Folk:
We did not change a lot to this one. One of the things we did do was raise their defense. We figured flying small targets should be hard to hit even if they have little armor. And that they should be pretty good shots but not much strength to throw things. Flying does add a bonus to their ST.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Above Average, Average, Good
SR:Average, Average, Average
CH:Very Poor, Poor, Poor
M1:Average, Below Average, Below Average
M2:Average, Below Average, Below Average
CO:Average, Poor, Poor
DE:Below Average, Poor, Average
ST:Average, Below Average, Poor

[Olorin]

Forgotten:
The problems with this Kingdom do not lie in its military. The ratings understate their abilities if anything. Probably because they are fairly new. We shifted their ratings a bit. Their charge is fearsome. Face it, these are the monsters that the other monsters thought were misshapen and weird. Tentacles in odd places, half troll-half centaur, giant purple worms, etc.


Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Good, Good, Good
SR:Above Average, Average, Good
CH:Good, Good, Excellent
M1:Good, Superior, Good
M2:Good, Excellent, Good
CO:Good, Very Good, Good
DE:Above Average, Average, Average
ST:Above Average, Good, Above Average

[Strongwill]

Ents… They decimated Saruman’s orcs and goblins with boulders in the two towers? Just saying

[Olorin]

Free Traders:
These guys do not want to fight, they want to sell you a used car, um, chariot. Imagine used car salesmen drafted into a military unit. This is them. The one thing they likely practice is shooting. From as far away as possible. Climb a ladder while getting shot at? Are you kidding me? We really did not change much of anything.

Posted, Actual, Proposed
LR:Average, Average, Average
SR:Above Average, Average, Good
CH:Not A Factor, Poor, Poor
M1:Below Average, Poor, Poor
M2:Below Average, Poor, Poor
CO:Below Average, Very Poor, Poor
DE:Above Average, Average, Below Average
ST:Below Average, Poor, Not A Factor

---

Ents… They decimated Saruman’s orcs and goblins with boulders in the two towers? Just saying

Not by the books. They ripped them apart in hand to hand, and then ripped down all the walls and towers except for the main tower where they could get no purchase on the enchanted walls.